" Funny question! I think anywhere you go there is going to be something you don't like about the area. I was born and raised in Klamath falls. I remember being younger and wanting to leave and as a I got older I was feeling more and more sucked in to the everyday drama and everything else that goes on there. We moved away almost 3 years ago and everytime I go back I am glad to leave again. It almost seems as time stands still there. People are still doing the same thing year after year. No one wants to do anything to better themselves. "

" Honestly Klamath is a good place to live. But there are quiet a few problems also. For one 1 cant really believe how many people didnt acknowledge the fact that we have a ton of drugs. A lot of it is underground but you would be suprised how easy it is for teenagers to get meth pills or just alcohol. Just because it seems like teenagers are young and immature doesnt mean they wanted to get into drugs. If we didnt have meth here in Klamath there would be A LOT less problems. This place is one of the biggest distributors of drugs and its ridiculous that its not being taken care of. Also its sad seeing all these teenagers having sex at such young ages and also seeing 16 year olds or younger raising babies. Another thing is its hard to get jobs here and that very sad because there should be tons of opportunities here. Jobs are a huge thing to this community. I see people everyday struggling to live and its awful. I have nothing against people who move here. Maybe some of those newcomers want to make a difference for the better. If only something was done about all the drugs and dealers then things would be way different here but until then this community is only going down hill. "

" Klamath is beautiful. Other places may be as beautiful but no place is more beautiful!
I may be prejudice in some odd way because I was born in KFalls, as was my Pa,
But you know we migrated to Alaska in the early fifties and it really made all of us a lot broader folks. I get the feeling some of you are still waiting for Dixie to rise again around there. Ya know, it's just over. Wood is beautiful but too damned much of it got wasted. Time waits for no one. You've got geothermal. Ya know careers are what make folks happy not jobs. jobs are about getting by. 10 years of getting by is okay, but the mentality in those parts is too often just getting by. "

" Observing the previous blog entries I am getting this sense of "Provincial Pride". My mother had an appropriate saying about those who don't see the dangers of not updating their personal attitudes. The saying goes something like this; " A skunk never turns around and smells it's own backend and for good reasons!"
Klamath Falls is a family community but its an "economicly challenged" community (no economic infrastructure) that will not change its ways for the benefit of its citizens, even if it means their future. Oh yeah the campus of OIT and the military at Kingsley are the only really positive spots here in KF's so quit bashing these entities. "

" If we didn't have realtives to help us out right now, we would be most likely homeless. We went and checked out the lower income apts all over town, and they are full-up with very young, single parents. When we'd just need the cheaper housing for a short time. Sadly there is a lengthy waiting period, because who really is going to move out when rent is so cheap?? So we must be thankful for what we can have right now! "

" Taylor:

Some constructive thoughts for you from another concerned and civic-minded citizen:

1) You say "one thing I think we should change...". Businesses in general trust their employees, and they also find comfort in hiring a "known quantity". If the manager of McDonald's or Burger King is faced with hiring you (who is admittedly non-social, applying for a job in the SERVICE industry) or their shift supervisor's cousin's husband who has experience in fast food, who do you think they are going to hire? I would suggest that you get involved with a church, the food bank, Kiwanis club, or even volunteer at the Gospel Mission. Something to begin building a network and building your social comfort. You'd be surprised how these new networks of people you meet will look out for you when you are faced with stuff like unemployment. Networking (not the good ol boys or other stupid crap people try to ram down your throat) is an accepted, effective way to get better jobs.

2) Totally agree with you. There are local organizations like KCEDA, the Chamber, etc. that absolutely see this need, and are fighting everyday on behalf of you and me to make this happen.

3) I agree, at least inasmuch as people trying to force their ideas on others. I do raise my familly here, and choose to demonstrate through actions how I think people should act and treat others. And, I choose to teach my children to respect the opinions of others, and to have the courage to ask people with differences of opinion to support their position with facts and useful information. And, most importantly, to be prepared to support their own position with facts and useful information.

4) A topic in and of itself. Generally, though, I agree with you. The assistance you mentioned SHOULD come with strings attached!

4) "

" I am in total agreement on 1 (taylor).
Ive applied at several places also, I have lots of steady, good experience. And either NO callbacks, or I walk in and on several occasions they've hired some early early 20's maybe teenager. I am not an older person re-entering the workplace, I am your average 30's professional male. Perfectly capable of any job out there. And way more experienced then these children being hired by the businesses here! How come I walk in to check on an application and your training a 18yr old how to do operate and understand certain electronic equipment, when I applied for this position and have a vast knowledge of this? Why are these kids getting the advantages over us family men? This town is getting frustrating! Start hiring people that are experienced. DO NOT hire because they are your friends kid, your childs friend, ETC. We have families to support! "

" I lived there for 10 years and was/am very well known in the community. I now happily live in Jackson County as I really had enough of K-falls and got tired of hoping it would indeed change for the better. My take on why Klamath won't and can't change is the firm right-wing stance of the local government and the tight network of good-old boys and gals that have lived there since time began. The attitude of "well this is the way we do things here" gets real old when progress should be made... "

" Modesty will not help our town.
We need to stand up for change! (not obama change). But change locally.
And if people here dont agree we need change on all levels here in KF, they have that right to disagree. And we have the right to leave if the 'native Kfalls folks' hold our town back. Im from a several generation klamath family too, and I want change. "

" I don't have anything real against this town, but there are areas i think need to be improved.

1: out of 1891 Applications, I have had no callbacks. No interviews. Nothing. I have applied at mcd's and burger king, and nothing. I'm not a social person, preferring to keep more to myself living a simple life. I can only assume my lack of contacts in the community is a reason for the lack of interviews. One thing i think that we should change is the hiring process. Don't hire because you know someone who knows someone, hire based off a professional application and resume. Give everyone a chance not just hire someone because they are your 2nd cousins childhood friend.

2: More living wage jobs need to be developed.

3: I would really like people to be more open minded for those who are different or even out of the so called norm. It seems as though most people in the area base their ideas on how life for everyone should be upon their own religious beliefs that not everyone share. I don't think i would raise a family here for that very reason. I wouldn't want my children picking that up, or subjected to it should they be the person that falls into the different category.

4: This is mostly a state wide thing but i have an issue with 2 18 year olds having a kid and then getting 450.00 a month in food stamps which is spent buying foods i cant afford myself. People who were irresponsible are being rewarded with steaks and prime rib on a nightly basis while those of us who do anything to survive are lucky to smell a steak cooking on a neighbors grill let alone eat one. I heard in Safeway that a guy in his late teens early twenties with his cart full of expensive groceries, bragging to another because his rent was 58.00 a month.

Why cant we make these deadbeat losers who are miliing our system and have no sense of civic or self pride pay for their current free rides with community service? Why arent they out there picking trash as payment for their aide? Why cant we have a ballot measure that orders THAT rather than stupid school merger? "

" I was one of those people that was told to just leave town because I did not agree with the local militarists. So I did. "

" And JR I am sure people appreciate your modesty...... "

" I see everyone got gloves on LOL.
Sure is easy to see which people are causing the problems here in KF. Like always I'm very amused by the ignorance of my fellow residents. "

" Fasttrack = doesn't live here, doesn't work here, drove through here but once...reads online blogs on the internet (which was *gasp* created by the military) and he/she thinks he-she knows us. Ha! He/she has a right to his/her opinion, though..and has the military to thank for it! Ha!

Fasttrack = internet troll Ignore him/her! "

" Don't worry Fast track, you didn't get my goat.

I'm not emotional about any of this, just factual. So many negative comments from you about this little town to which you really have no part of....what's up with that. "

" I find a lot of serenity in KF kayaking the rivers and lakes where the only stop signs are wildlife and old trees. I find courage (Faith) in my fight against discrimination and I find wisdom in how I make a difference in the community. "

" Sorry BS, I did not realize how easy it was to get your goat, so I am unfairly taking advantage of you. My sincere apologies. Actually, I neither live nor work in Klamath Falls, so I don't contribute a thing to your community except my annoying letters. But I do enjoy reading the Herald & News blogs. You folks there are so emotional about the military. It is practically a religion with many of you. Driving though town one time, I actually saw a bumper sticker, "Jet Noise is the Sound of Freedom." "

" Fast track,

There has never been an F-15 Dismantled and trucked back to base. Get your facts straight before throwing them around. All military aircraft will land at an alternate location for safety reasons if any problems occur. They don't even have to be dangerous malfunctions for a pilot to elect to land somewhere else.

Ladies and gentlemen.......fast track has no idea what he is spouting off about. There are plenty of Air Guard members around, if you have a question ask one of them. Ignore this clown.

FYI a few years ago Kingsley took on a volunteer project for the Air Force Museum to prepare and dismantle an aging F-15 for use at a museum in Ohio. All the work was done by volunteers and didn't spend a dollar of taxpayer money. It was dismantled and placed on a flat bed for transportation to the museum in Ohio.

try again chicken little......... "

" I am a person who is from here, my parents are from here and my grandparents are from here, and their grandparents and their grandparents. As a matter of fact my people were created here. The more people that come here the worse it gets. There are to many weirdos and perverts moving here, everyday a new story of some sexual predator preying on the weak.
Any family that hasn't been here for over 100 generations should go be weird in their own home, not here.
If this is progress who needs it.
Why move to a place and change it to what you moved from. So you can move again, and ruin that community?
We live in the most beautiful place in the world and it is slowly going down hill, because so many need to live in a city!

IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT GO HOME. "

" As a 3rd year transplant from Calif, I can honestly say Klamath is a pleasant change from the hustle and bustle of the Bay Area. In the short time we have been here, I know ALL of my neighbors and have met many very nice people who truly care for their fellow man. I have, however, experienced some cliquish attitudes towards "non native KFS" people and particularily Californians. I find overall it's a small number of folks. Many of whom have little or no intellect. In the overall scheme of things, it's a refreshing lifestyle of both people and nature. "

" We've lived here several years, moved away for several years, and lived here before for several years. The crime here IS getting comparable to worse then other cities we have lived in. Mostly the drug and burglary crimes. ( I can only imagine how much worse it will get with our economy). I wish our state would just send the drug crimes straight to prison for at least one year. This morning I'm reading the public safety and once again I see another meth user, caught by the law, and released. I have to say WTF to that! You know exactly what he's gonna go do! Go home and get high again! So this being said, many of our friends are also considering leaving. And we are not 'new comers', we are people who have invested several decades into this town. Of course we'll probably come back, thats what klamath does, its all of our little black hole. But maybe the government will realize we need better patrols, (yes in the bad areas). And harder punishment for the drug crimes.
Sadly yes meth is running crazy all over Oregon. But this town seems to be one of the worst. As we've lived in other cities in Oregon and have 1st hand experience. Is it because of all the 'deals' our city hands out to the users to fold on their dealers? Plain and simply, us long time residents are sad by the state of our city. "

" i'm thinking about moving here and all I can say is WOW! good luck "

" I think those patriotic readers who love the "Sound of Freedom" and dread next summer when Kingsley moves its F-15s elsewhere, could move away, perhaps to San Diego where there are lots of real estate bargains to be found near the Miramar Air Station. As of today there is even a vacant lot where you can build the house of your dreams and listen to the "Sound of Freedom" fly right overhead every day. "

" The Sound of Freedom is wonderful, and drowns out "Freedom of Speech" for those dissidents we hope will move away. I, for one, am very tired of their unpatriotic, un-Klamathian ramblings. "

" Dear Len, There have been two crashes here since 1992, one southeast of here, pancaked into the ground, killing the brave pilot during low level flying exercises, and one visiting Canadian fighter that crashed into a local farm just south of the Kingsley runway. This pilot ejected and saved himself, but fortunately the jet missed the farmer's home and only two cows were killed and a $35 K irrigation system destroyed. And don't forget the F-15 that failed flying over the Rogue Valley, making an emergency landing in Medford. This plane was unable to fly back to Kingsley and had to be dismantled and carried back on a flatbed. "

" People need to stop compaining about klamath. Klamath is a safe place to raise a family! Go else where your faced with some of our once in a few years crimes on an hourly basis! This is nothing people! You hear about a murder here like what...once a year, try everyday in bigger cities! Your wishing for too much, like everyone turning into the Brady Bunch. Wimps. You wouldn't last a minute in LA "

" WE ARE NOT DENSELY POPULATED!!!!!
And wtf?! A crash! Seriously...how many years have the jest been here? NO CRASH!! so your saying that the jets should stop flying because 2 jets crashed with in 2 years out of millions of jets that fly on a daily basis. Cars should stop driving in that case because there are ALOT of crashes here in klamath. "

" I really do enjoy living here in Klamath. I've lived here and in the Seattle area off and on for several years now. I enjoy the jets flying over on a sunny day. It reminds me of home. It's a sound you can't hear elsewhere. It's small, everyone knows everyone. The crime really is nothing compaired to other cities. We only hear about it faster because the city is so small. I would feel confident to say if you don't like klamath, leave! "

" I'm a transplant to Oregon, and enjoy Klamath Falls. I think it could be better, but it could be a lot worse.

I read this website quite a bit and I guess the one thing that bothers me is that when anyone says something that disagrees with the general leaning of the population, they are attacked. Anonymous posters can be very hateful and its really unfortunate, although, its the nature of the beast.

I'd like to think that most people who live here aren't actually that angry at people with opposing viewpoints, but would at least offer others the respect to speak without fear of being downright skewered in a blog posting. "

" These comments do illustrate my point. The question asked "Should people just leave if they don't like Klamath Falls?" talks about "complaints from newcomers" and should THEY leave. But it is NOT the newcomers that are complaining. "

" I think both sides make an interesting point. I agree wit hthose that say, unless you're part of the problem, it won't do any good to leave....however, even if you're not one of 'them' you have to see it, or hear it, or live near it and that can get VERY troubling- especially if you have kids, or elderly that can be fallen victim to people. The main problem we have in Klamath is the drug use, bar none. Most people in this town that WANT to work, and aren't picky about working in a field or something menial like that, have jobs. There is always an exception, yes. Wwhat bothers me is these people that don't work, that are on (I assume) State assistance, because their grocery carts are alot more full than mine is, and they are bouncing around in line at the story high as could be. I think the KFPD does a great job; they just need input from neighbors and citizens about problem areas....they cant be everywhere at once. Someone mentioned the trailer park by Mollies, Mills Addition, and South 'Burbs- it is fair those places get targeted by the police to monitor....but not fair for people to say that they are 'all' druggies that live there....the Mills Addition is starting to really come around in places, more pride-of-ownership, and more responsibility to the residents to notify the police. Good Job! I dont live in that area, but I'm not that afraid to drive through it anymore. Keep up the great work down there! "

" Maybe Fast Track is right, considering the crash of a F-18 into homes near the Miramar base just a few hours ago. The pilot saved himself, but a least two, and perhaps more residents have died. Fortunately a nearby high school was spared. This is the 2nd F-18 from Miramar to crash in two years. This could happen here eventually. There is no reason to keep military air bases open near densely populated areas, there are plenty of wide open spaces still available in this country. "

" FT
I will read it thank you but is there a reason we can't have both? Look at what is happening with the Running Y/Ridgewater and even old town is starting to have some flair.
I love going out to Gallaghers at the Y and having a cigar and a glass of beer after Sunday lunch just to escape the daily routine of working and feeding the animals. there is so much potential here it is just astounding, thanks again for the reading reccomendation. "

" I lived in klamath when i was in my teens. I graduated from klamath union high. It was a strugaling town then, it's a strualing town now, thirty one years latter. It's just got alot more jiffy-lubs and fastfood places now.That's great if your a traveler who's in a hurry! Thrtyone years ago I was from a large progressive city and a place like K-Falls seemed like a place time had forgotten. It was'nt a place you could become wourdly or important if you where to have grown up there. It was a place where you could maybe retire in peace if your bones could take the bitter cold. Because it does'nt offer much in the way of jobs and the cost of living is low, that's proven to be a bad combination and the unsavories have taken up residency.Back in the 70's it was the hippies,of which i was one. If you could'nt afford to live in town you could camp in the thousand acres surrounding the town. Klamath it seems will always be a haven to fixed income retired, disabled,and other wise income challenged individuals. Unfortunatly this includes the drugies everyones talking about. taxes are what pays for police, drug programs etc. If the jobs arn't here the $'s not here. K-Falls is in a beautiful part of oregon alright, but it's beautiful in alot of places in the us. We all got choices. It's sad little mayberry-like towns get tainted by bad apples and it's even more sad that it takes $ to buffer yourself from them. The gap grows ever bigger. I'll always look back on my klamath days with fondness, but will only visit from now on. "

" To Year 3, We too love living in Klamath Falls, but this little slice of heaven is not going to be discovered by the mainstream or by wealthy retirees until we can free ourselves from the stranglehold of the military. So many of us feel totally dependent upon the military and hang on to the Air Guard's apron strings, as if we are afraid to let go and grow up to create our own future. There are plenty of success stories that can be found on the Internet, about how many localities have thrived after the military left. Try reading "Living the Good Life After Base Closure"
By Jim Garamone American Forces Press Service, just as one example. "

" I love it here, having lived all over Oregon in my 40 years I hope you people know what a beautiful place you live in and why its worth fighting for.
Yes there are alot of people who think Klamath is doom and gloom but the majority of the people I have come across are polite, friendly and inviting.
Someday this little slice of heaven is going to be discovered by the mainstream then revenue and jobs will flow in here like crazy, just hang in there my friends we are all so lucky to have gotten here first. And please keep a positive attitude it's the only thing each of us truly can control.
And yes as with anywhere there are issues but that is in anyplace you live, not just the Klamath Basin. Meth and politics are a problem in all of rural Oregon your not going to move away from it trust me on that one. "

" I grew up in Klamath, went to college in Klamath and then moved across the country to get away...
Klamath and it's citizens are stuck in their ways. There is so much ignorance and to many with an out dated, mentality. Dont get me wrong, I absolutely love the area (why else would I keep up with the local news and area happenings), but if Klamath wants to thrive new leaders need to emerge, new business partnerships need to be created, education needs to be not only in the schools but the community and home, and the people need to come together and find solutions to real problems. No matter whose ideals they are. "

" The place I work at hired a newbe from Cali. he turned our place upside down inside out,with shift changes, rearranged peoples hours frankly made a mess of a smooth operatiing dept. for 2yrs. then he has a mutual sceperation with the company, So yes it hard to accept their ideas. "

" I find three primary factions present in the Basin. The first are those that want this a safer and more economically viable community. This faction is willing to pay for the services that they desire and deserve. The second are those who have lived here for a long time, perhaps born here, who have no desire to see growth and work beneath the surface to see that it doesn't happen as they like it as "it has always been." This faction believes that they have a "right" to enhanced public services although will not pay one cent more in taxes to make it a reality. The third are those who have relocated here from larger cities and crowded areas who also do not wish to see any growth, as they are afraid that the Basin might become another "Bend." This third faction actually has the fiscal capability to see that the Basin receives enhanced services but is unwilling to part with their money. Those are the three primary factions as I see it. But there are other not so subtle voices here as well. These voices are a mix of the aforementioned factions and seem to relish in the division between the city and the county (suburbs.) These voices desire no combination of services and are more than willing to tolerate a county governing body that is fiscally troubled with no reprieve in sight. The city seems to be much more fiscally solvent than the county but is not trusted for some seemingly bogus reasons. Some of the previous posts rail against the "meth heads" and those who happen to live in some of our older neighborhoods. If you truly desire to see a difference in the Basin, we must become "one" community, not a community divided. Should we be known as a city of some 40,000 residents in lieu of the current 20,000, those looking to relocate their small and medium size businesses are much more likely to relocate here. And make no mistake about it, with the economy in its current state, there are those wishing to relocate to an area more tax friendly and liveable. But until we stop our needless bickering, (the city and county schools is a prime example), we will not see any meaningful change here. President elect Obama was elected on the platform of change. Change is beneficial. Let's give it a try and reap the benefits. "

" Hate to break it to you JR, but anywhere you go in Oregon is full of drug addicts and meth users. It isn't unique to Klamath Falls. "

" Just like anywhere else it depends on what you see here in Klamath, or what you chose to see. I live in mills addition I think that there are more patrol units cruising around there than any other neighborhood doin their jobs to help make this a better community. So kudos to our local law enforcement. I think you are doing a great job. Its the local court system and their drug court that needs some attention. But thats one mans opinion. "

" JR.
I agree.
We need to send the drug users off to rehab/jail/prison. For more then a week or 2 until they 'rat' out their dealers, etc. I hate walking/driving around this town and seeing the OBVIOUSLY high individuals. If I can see that they are obviously high and driving, how come the officers dont see them? Maybe we should push Klamath as a tourist town, clean it up, and keep the drug users off the streets.
Just a thought. But I understand what people are thinking - should we stay? Should we leave and hope it gets better? Maybe come back? Come on people instead of arguing and getting mad at people that are fed up and want to leave, how about you get out, and let it be known that we want our town clean and drug free! "

" What to do about Klamath?
Why not just live in it, I was born and raised here and like other folks has seen lots of changes in 65 years. One thing i have noticed is that a lot of the people I grew up and went to school with left and then came back to retire or when they found it is not so bad here. I find that i get older the cold bothers me more so we are going south for a while but it is hard to beat fall in Klamath County. Are there problems here, sure but where aren't there any. We don't have the crime that comes with the bigger cities, jobs are a problem but go find one elsewhere,I doubt you will. "

" We appreciate what we have. But we dont appreciate the druggies and scummy areas in town. How about we improve the nasty areas and the nasty people and then klamath will be a proud town. THE last thing we want is to raise our kids in a town FULL of METH heads, which this town is getting over ran with. So lets send them off to jail! Off to rehab, SOMETHING!! "

" The impression I get is that it isn't the newcomers who are complaining, it is a few of the folks who already live here, who don't appreciate what they have. The newcomers love it here. We are willing to give up the shopping. We love the small town feel, the friendly people, the outdoors, the beauty, the laid back feel. "

" They have every right to complain about rural, conservative America just like Bonnie Erbe on 12-5. What I can't understand is why the H&N bothers to pay her for her column of warmed over tripe. She wouldn't recognize reason, logic or quality writing if it bit her. H&N should save some money and throw a bone to many of our local writers printing their op/eds dumb or not at least they are free and anything beats Erbe. "

" After 29 years in the military and having lived in 13 locations from Korea to Georgia we wanted a place that provided us with "value". This isn't just about money but also about dignity and core values. We selected Klamath Falls and are glad we did. There are many problems to fix but people here for the most part are genuine and friendly. Perfect is not a word I would use to describe Klamath Falls, but even after all those moves we have made there isn't any place that we would rather live. "

" To JR: Funny thing is that wherever you may move to, there may be ONE problem: You take yourself with you!! Sometimes, it helps to look inward and see if you might just be a part of the problem-complaining about what could be instead of doing something about what is!! Working together makes things happen. I hope you find a perfect place to move to. OOPS!! You take yourself there, too. We love Klamath Falls and have been here a long time and plan on staying a whole lot longer. And yes, we are involved in our community in different arenas and are helping to make Klamath Falls awhole lot better. "

" How can one just "get rid" of a whole neighborhood? And hey, I know plenty of people who live in Mills Addition, the trailer park by Mollies AND the area around Altamont and they're all pretty decent people. Nice string of generalizations and prejudices, there. You want to get rid of the "druggies"? Get on the phone to the police, watch your neighborhood, teach your kids and their friends about the effects of doing drugs. Be proactive instead of expecting someone else to fix things. Unless YOU are part of the problem, leaving Klamath isn't going to help it. "

" I believe that everyone has something to offer Klamath County. Many times, the complaints we hear from people is that they are frustrated with certain aspects. This is a good time to become involved in some activity or service orgainzation or government where they can have a voice to share what they see as the solution. Becomng a part of the solution instead of just talking about the problem will help everyone! Welcome to Klamath County!! We value your input and suggestions. "

" I'm a newcomer. I came from another part of Oregon but I am a Californian. Klamath, like any other city, has its problems. And, like any other city, there are people trying to make it better and people who just make it worse by their very existence. Three cheers to the folks who work at making it a better place to live, through volunteering or maintaining their property or by sticking around and fighting to make it a better place. Folks who leave often find a whole new set of problems in their new town. You can stick around and help fix it or you can bail, it's up to each individual. "

" Our familys are here so that is why we are here. We would love to move to a better community, until this community gets better. It seems like it is going to take several years, (if it even ever happens), for this town to improve. But until we get rid of the druggies, get rid of the mills addition and areas around altamont st, trailer court by mollys, we will never see a true improvement. And yes, Im sure alot of the klamath folks that have been out of this town will leave and probably come back again when things are better. We are considering it, and know of SEVERAL long time residents who are considering leaving for a while. Its not that were abandoning klamath, its that klamath has made a turn for the worst, and until local officals realize this and make the apropriate cuts and improvements in the correct areas klamath is destined to fail. OH and we've lived in california, big cities, and the sad thing is, californians are in the majority, NICER then the klamath folks. "